present practice of insuring is prejudicial to our commerce, nor have I found any disagreement between my constituents and the traders of this great metropolis.

I am unwilling to imagine that there can be any evil for which the wisdom of this assembly cannot discover a remedy, and am, therefore, of opinion, that if the grievance is real, some expedient may be discovered for removing it; and that it is real, I cannot but be convinced by the declarations of so many men, who can have no interest in complaining when they suffer nothing, and whose known abilities exempt them_from the suspicion of imputing any part of their uneasiness to a cause which cannot produce it.

The bill before us, sir, requires, in my opinion, some amendments, and in its present state might, perhaps, produce more detriment than advantage; but since it is necessary at least to attempt something for the relief of men so useful to this nation, it appears to me necessary to form a committee, and to deliberate on this subject with more attention.

Mr. LOCKWOOD spoke next, to the following effect :Sir, though I am not of opinion that the bill in its present state ought to be passed into a law, yet I am far from thinking it so imperfect as not easily to be amended, and, therefore, am desirous that it should be considered in a committee.

I have not, indeed, sir, often observed, that bills injudiciously drawn up at first have received great improvements from a second consideration, and have found it more easy to form a new bill, than to make alterations in one that is laid before us; for some original errour will commonly remain, and the sentiments of different men, pursuing different views, can seldom be modelled into one consistent scheme. But I am far from considering this bill as one of those that cannot be amended, for I can discover but few objections to the regulations proposed in it, and those not relating to any of the essential parts, but slight and circumstantial, such as will easily be removed, or, perhaps,

The grievance, sir, for which this bill proposes a remedy, is so generally known, and so universally lamented, that, I believe, there is not any thing more worthy of the attention of the legislature than an inquiry into the cause of it, and the proper method of redressing it.

In our inquiry into the causes of this obstruction of trade, I am of opinion, sir, that the practice of insuring, interest or no interest, will appear to be the foundation of this general uneasiness; it will be found a practice of so natural a tendency to fraud, and so easily susceptible of dishonest artifices, that I believe every member of this house will desire its suppression.

To confirm my assertion, sir, and illustrate the question before us, I shall mention some particular instances of fraud to which this custom has given occasion; of fraud so evident and so detestable that it cannot be related with.. out indignation.

The Royal George was a large ship belonging to the South sea company, which, having been a voyage to Vera Cruz, put in at Jamaica in her return; and being there refitted to proceed on her voyage homewards, set sail, and came within a week's sailing of the port, when, upon a sudden, the officers entered into a consultation, and determined to go back a month's voyage to Antigua; for what reason, sir, may easily be guessed, when it was told that a ship was insured upon a supposed value of sixty thousand pounds.

This resolution, sir, was no sooner formed, than orders were given to change the course and steer to Antigua, in opposition to all the remonstrances of the carpenter, who is the proper judge of the condition of a vessel, and who declared, with honesty and resolution, against their whole procedure. But they pursued their new scheme without any regard to his murmurs or assertions; and when they arrived at Antigua, found some method of influencing the officers of that island to declare the ship unfit for the prosecution of the voyage.

Their design, sir, was now happily completed. To confirm the determination which had been pronounced in their favour, they stranded the ship upon a bank of sand, forced out the iron that grapples the timber together, and having first taken away the masts and rigging, and whatever else could be used or sold, threw the ballast to each end, and so broke the vessel in the middle.

By this well-contrived shipwreck, having, as they imagined, raised their fortunes, they came home triumphantly from their prosperous voyage, and claimed the money for which the ship was insured. The insurers, startled at a demand so unexpected, inquired into the affair with all the industry which its importance might naturally incite, and, after some consultation, determined to try whether the ship might not be refitted and brought to Britain.

In pursuance of this resolution, they sent workmen and materials, and, without much expense, or any difficulty, brought it hither.

I believe, sir, this relation is sufficient at once to prove the practice, and explain the nature of the frauds to which this method of insurance gives occasion; but as the frequency of them is such, that many instances may be produced, I shall offer another short narrative of the same kind.

A ship that belonged to the East India company, insured after this method, was run ashore by the captain, in such a manner that he imagined none but himself able to recover it, and therefore, though it cost five thousand pounds, sold it for five hundred; but the purchaser, no less expert than the captain, found means very speedily to disengage it, to restore it to a proper condition with little expense, and was much enriched by his fortunate bargain.

I cannot but observe, sir, that this kind of fraud is more formidable, as it may be practised without a possibility of detection: had the captain, instead of stranding, destroyed his vessel, how could his wickedness ever have been discovered; or how could the South sea company's ship have been brought home, had it been sunk in some distant corner of the world.

This practice, sir, and the frauds which it has occasioned, and the suspicions which the easy practice of frauds al

ways creates, have produced so many trials, and filled the courts of justice with such intricate contentions, that the judges, who know, perhaps, nothing of this practice but from its effects, have often declared it to be so pregnant with contests and cheats, that it ought not to be suffered, and that a law for suppressing it would much contribute to the establishment of peace, and the security of property.

I am not insensible, sir, of the force of the argument made use of by the honourable gentleman who spoke in favour of this practice, and cannot but allow it that regard which his reasonings always deserve; it is the strongest, and perhaps the only argument that can be produced. His assertion of the impossibility of estimating the real value of a ship, or of foreknowing the success of a voyage, is incontestable: but perhaps it will follow from thence, not that an imaginary value ought to be admitted, but that no insurance ought to be allowed, where there is no rational method of ascertaining it; or, at least, that all such insurance ought to be rather below the probable value than above it.

If the grievance complained of has been proved not to be imaginary, we ought, doubtless, to consult how it may be remedied; nor do I believe that our consultations will be ineffectual, if we engage in them, not with an intention to perplex, but to inform each other. I am of opinion, sir, that the importance of the question requires a committee; nor can I discover any essential defect in the bill, which should hinder it from passing into a law.

Mr. BURRELL spoke to this effect:- Sir, I am convinced by experience, as well as reason, that so many inconveniencies arise from this method of insurance, that it affords so many opportunities of fraud, and gives such encouragement to negligence, that I shall willingly concur in any measures that may effectually suppress it.

It is, sir, too well known to require proof, that interest is the parent of diligence, and that men attend to the performance of their duty, in proportion as they must suffer by the neglect of it; and, therefore, every practice that deprives honesty of its reward is injurious to the publick.

But that this is the consequence of estimating ships at

an imaginary value in the offices of insurance, is, to the highest degree, evident. When a ship is estimated above its real value, how will the commander suffer by a wreck, or what shall restrain him from destroying his vessel, when it may be done with security to himself, except that integrity, which, indeed, ought to be generally diffused, but which is not always to be found, and to which few men think it safe to trust upon occasions of far less importance.

To show, sir, that I do not indulge groundless suspicions, or magnify the bare possibility of fraud into reality; that I do not blacken human nature, or propose laws against wickedness that has not yet existed; it may be proper to mention some letters, in which I have been informed, by my correspondent at Leghorn, of the state of the ships which have arrived there; ships so weakly manned, and so penuriously or negligently stored, so much , decayed in the bottoms, and so ill fitted with rigging, that he declares his astonishment at their arrival.

It may deserve our consideration, sir, whether the success of the Spanish privateers may not be, in great part, attributed to this pernicious practice; whether captains, when their vessels are insured for more than their value, do not rashly venture into known danger? whether they do not wilfully miss the security of convoys? whether they do not direct their courses where privateers may most securely cruise? whether they do not surrender with less resistance than interest would excite? and whether they do not raise clamours against the government for their ill success, to avoid the suspicion of negligence or fraud?

That other frauds are committed in the practice of insuring, is well known to the honourable gentleman: it is a common practice to take money upon bottomry, by way of pledge, for the captain's fidelity, and to destroy this security by insuring above the real value; so that the captain may gain by neglecting the care of his vessel, or, at least, secure himself from loss, and indulge his ease or his pleasure without any interruption from the fear of diminishing his fortune.